Cleverley

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Cleverley

Post  QBVILLA on Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:09 pm

I just can't see how he's deemed international class. Am I missing something? For me his passing is erratic, he's lightweight on the ball, doesn't cover much ground and although he does get into good positions his finishing is very poor. Thoughts?
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Re: Cleverley

Post  villanfromluton on Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:17 pm

Tend to agree QB, would he be part of the squad if he was at Villa for instance? There again, it was a shock to see Shelvey in a full England game, to think Dennis Mortimer never played for his country, disgrace
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Re: Cleverley

Post  QBVILLA on Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:22 pm

The amount of caps the Villa players from 75-84 was disgraceful considering how good our sides were. To be fair that was thd case of all the Midlands clubs. As for Shelvey i think he's got the makings of a good midfielder. Cleverley must have something but i just can't see it myself.





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Re: Cleverley

Post  villanfromluton on Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:26 pm

If Fergie picks him he obviously has something, but like you, I am not sure what his main strength is. He dont score many goals, has 2 recently, and dont seem to create that much. To be fair, havent seen too much of Shelvey, but it does seem to show there is a lack of depth at the present time if he gets picked
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Re: Cleverley

Post  jak on Sat Oct 13, 2012 6:14 am

Cleverley is overrated. If he's the best we've got we're gonna struggle against anyone decent.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  Avfc_4eva_Sotc on Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:42 am

Said the same thing during the game last night Qb, I think he is extremely average, if he wasn't at Man U he wouldn't even be in contention for a place.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  jpr60 on Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:37 pm

I think Cleverley is a good worker, he covers a lot of ground and has technical ability - could develop into a Paul Scholes sort of player.
Shelvey? Well - my comment last night was "at least Shawcross isn't on the pitch". For me Shelvey is an effin' embarrassment, as in, he's representing English football at it's highest level - that is ridiculous.
When I look back - the young players that came in for England way back when were very good players, even if they were young they already deserved their respective places (e.g. Jimmy Greaves). Today we're seeing players getting full England caps who are still learning their trade for Chrissake (and I include the above plus Walker, The Ox, Walcott, Welbeck). It's good to see the young players coming through but I think it (again) says a lot about just how short we've been of truly class players in the England set-up in recent times that youngsters can come in just like that - and it's not sure that they'll become top-class players IMO.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  jak on Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:35 pm

Very cleverly put, jpr.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  villanfromluton on Sat Oct 13, 2012 10:22 pm

I totally agree with you JPR about the young talent, not confident that Cleverley will be half the player Scholes is though
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Re: Cleverley

Post  Guest on Tue Oct 16, 2012 2:11 pm

I don't see what's wrong with getting the youngsters in early. Look at the Germans - had a crap couple of years, got the youngsters in despite little competitive experience, now they're back to being.. well the Germans.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  ADRIAN_1976 on Tue Oct 16, 2012 2:36 pm

I agree with Jesus Shocked

If we don't play the likes of Walcott Ox Walker then who gets the nod instead?

The problem as Jpr highlighted is the quality coming thru upto the task.. if Cleverly is the best we have then we have to play him and accept we don't have the class..
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Re: Cleverley

Post  QBVILLA on Tue Oct 16, 2012 2:51 pm

I don't care if the player is 37 or 17. Football is a now thing if you don't get the present right then there is no future. Cleverley imo isn't international class at this moment in time.
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Re: Cleverley

Post  Guest on Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:58 am

With the qualifying group we have, I think it's sensible to give the younger players 10 caps before the Brazil world cup. Aside from Ukraine, we should win every single game with comfort.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  QBVILLA on Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:53 am

Only if they are good enough though.
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Re: Cleverley

Post  jak on Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:49 pm

QBVILLA wrote:Only if they are good enough though.
QB, you have wisdom beyond your years.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  villainies on Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:33 pm

Who should've been picked ahead of Cleverly?
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Re: Cleverley

Post  Guest on Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:40 pm

I think Cleverley is keeping the role warm for Rooney tbh. Once Carroll is fit again I'd wager Woy will have Carroll and Defoe starting with Rooney in the hole.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  ADRIAN_1976 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:53 pm

I wanted the old guard gone and replaced by the new lads.. but looking at it we have some shite quality coming thru..

Milner is a work man like player.. Welbeck isnt a semi final/final quality striker.. actually we have nothing coming thru striker wise.. Ash Young is shite.. he's back to his last season at Villa days.. doing F all.. midefield wise we dont have a quality ball winner.. Rodwell will mess up at City.. Cleverley is decent but nothing special..

Wilshire and Ox only two that you look at with confidence..

We are good enough to beat the likes of Poland etc.. get through to the major finals.. but quarters at best really..
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Re: Cleverley

Post  Guest on Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:39 pm

Welbeck can play shite all game but be in the right place at the right time when it counts. He'll be an England regular once he learns his game. Proper goalscorer.

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Re: Cleverley

Post  Bedshammer on Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:41 pm

How can you view Wilshere with confidence? He hasn't played for such a long time.
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Re: Cleverley

Post  ADRIAN_1976 on Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:11 pm

Bedshammer wrote:How can you view Wilshere with confidence? He hasn't played for such a long time.

I meant talent wise Beds.. still think when he comes back he will carry on progressing..

Im not pinning any hopes on Cleverly Young Wellbeck to get us that elusive trophy..
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Re: Cleverley

Post  Bedshammer on Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:25 pm

ADRIAN_1976 wrote:
Bedshammer wrote:How can you view Wilshere with confidence? He hasn't played for such a long time.

I meant talent wise Beds.. still think when he comes back he will carry on progressing..

Im not pinning any hopes on Cleverly Young Wellbeck to get us that elusive trophy..

He may prove to be another Owen or Ledley King.
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Re: Cleverley

Post  Jay.P.A on Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:22 pm

Bedshammer wrote:How can you view Wilshere with confidence? He hasn't played for such a long time.

He's already showed he's a very, very good player.

He'll need alot of recovery time now - but once he's fully fit, I think we'll have a better England midfield with him in it.
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Re: Cleverley

Post  QBVILLA on Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:46 pm

Personally i'd play with out and out wingers. This tippy tappy Spanish style football is great but we don't have the players to play it effectively. We'll certainly not be able to outdo the best nations. However, what we do have in abundance is wingers. Ades as per usual is making daft statements. Young is out injured so how he can say he is in shit form is beyond me. Chamberlain is what you'd expect from a young winger, inconsistent and IMO looks to me like a central midfielder in the making. However in Lennon and Walcott on the right and Young and Adam Johnson on the left we have genuine pace and excitement. Rooney is in the main an enigma but you still expect him to fire. Defoe is a striker who certainly isn't afraid to have a pop. In Carroll and Crouch we have two strikers who give an aerial threat which international sides struggle with. Middle of the park Gerrard is one of the finest midfielders in world football. In Hart we have a great keeper for the next ten years and i think we are strong at fulback. It's centre half and that spot alongside Gerrard i think we're falling short. Wilshire has promised a lot but as yet his career hasn't got going. We should play to our strengths not fail miserably at being continental. Twenty years of Premiership football hasn't made our players any better technically. What we have is strength and pace. Fcuking utilise it. Sport is always about winning and how we win matters not.
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Re: Cleverley

Post  ADRIAN_1976 on Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:24 pm

QBVILLA wrote:Personally i'd play with out and out wingers. This tippy tappy Spanish style football is great but we don't have the players to play it effectively. We'll certainly not be able to outdo the best nations. However, what we do have in abundance is wingers. Ades as per usual is making daft statements. Young is out injured so how he can say he is in shit form is beyond me. Chamberlain is what you'd expect from a young winger, inconsistent and IMO looks to me like a central midfielder in the making. However in Lennon and Walcott on the right and Young and Adam Johnson on the left we have genuine pace and excitement. Rooney is in the main an enigma but you still expect him to fire. Defoe is a striker who certainly isn't afraid to have a pop. In Carroll and Crouch we have two strikers who give an aerial threat which international sides struggle with. Middle of the park Gerrard is one of the finest midfielders in world football. In Hart we have a great keeper for the next ten years and i think we are strong at fulback. It's centre half and that spot alongside Gerrard i think we're falling short. Wilshire has promised a lot but as yet his career hasn't got going. We should play to our strengths not fail miserably at being continental. Twenty years of Premiership football hasn't made our players any better technically. What we have is strength and pace. Fcuking utilise it. Sport is always about winning and how we win matters not.

Whats daft about it.. he was shite in Euros and United fans in general are saying he wasn't great near the end of season.. we saw at Villa he can't play ion the hole and in general was average in his last season for us.. he doesn't excite me that he will get us to a final of a major tournament.. but he is the best of what we have so we got to go with it..

As for the rest of what you say.. are you still living in the 70's Shocked Shocked Playing that way has achieved what for us in our history.. we have played ONE major semi final in our history outside these shores.. bloody Turkey have a better record..

4-4-2 with two out and out wingers doesn't work in international football unless you have top top wingers.. you also need a brilliant holding midfielder as you will be out numbered in midfield.. something else we don't posses.. we don't keep the ball enough and would get run ragged ( we do).. we can play that way as the so called English way but our tournament record wont improve.. we can't even fluke a semi or final like Greece have..

All in all the players coming thru and what we have.. we are a million miles away from winning anything..


Last edited by ADRIAN_1976 on Thu Oct 18, 2012 1:30 pm; edited 2 times in total
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